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Wynta

Problems with PvP right now.

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People will naturally find the broken specs, and once they are found they should be tuned down within reason.  On the other hand some things were easy to find, completely obvious in their brokenness and should have been fixed a while ago.

Problem #1: Defensive CD stacking.

Most builds are tight on TE and not on AE, which means that when you have a bunch of TE left over you get buffs and defensive cooldowns.  That becomes a problem when you can then chain defensive cooldowns for 30 seconds straight.

Grouping similar effects to where they share cooldowns would help and/or making each defensive CD put all Defensive CD's on a 10-20 sec cooldown would help too.

Defensive cooldowns make some range specs able to ignore all defensive talents and just rotate cooldowns, combine this with knockbacks and movement abilities and u have someone who is glass cannon but extremely hard to kill

Problem #2: Poisons on Ranged Weapons.

This only becomes a problem when you have a 500 damage instant poison on every other attack plus auto applying crippling poison.  Ranged doing the damage they do without having to waste gcd's on slows is stupid.

Problem #3: Titan Grip builds.

Nothing is wrong with them besides Bladestorm and Killing Spree. CC immunity, and huge damage.

Make bladestorm only hit with the mainhand, and killing spree only useable with 1 handers, maybe even shapeshifted.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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So your Idea is simple: NERF everything! Good job mate! The only thing you forgot to mention was healing. Lets make all spell deal 1 damage and crit by 2! that would be awesome as balance! No more Op builds! My idea is simple: give everyone a bag full of potential and lets see who uses it better! This server is about freedon not balance!

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On 1/22/2018 at 1:57 PM, Chronosk said:

So your Idea is simple: NERF everything! Good job mate! The only thing you forgot to mention was healing. Lets make all spell deal 1 damage and crit by 2! that would be awesome as balance! No more Op builds! My idea is simple: give everyone a bag full of potential and lets see who uses it better! This server is about freedon not balance!

Not everything, just the broken shit that ruins pvp. If you honestly think this then you're autistic and probably only use one of the above builds. Probably the titans grip one as it provides a build that doesn't require thinking.


YES, bladestorm should slow the user or use only one weapon, and be on the same cooldown as killing spree imo.

Divine shield and Ice Block should also be on the same cooldown or at least have hypothermia affect divine shield and the divine shield debuff apply to iceblock to prevent it for 45 seconds. 

I honestly also like the idea of putting divine shield back to the original 10 second duration to  allow divine shield hearthing but make the damage nerf from 50% to like 75% or something to prevent abuse. 

 

There's also no reason to not nerf poisons on ranged weapons to encourage the utility poisons like wound or crippling. every hit shouldnt be doing 500 bonus damage but removing them entirely from them kinda hurts pvp I would think.

Edited by runemaster

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Some comments don't warrant a reply. Just add a confused emoji next to their post. A lot of the people trying to debate/argue on these forums are just posting their feelings and opinions and lacking in any creative or rational thought towards game design.  

It's like children arguing over what ice cream they think taste the best and thinking they should make business decisions based on their outcome(generally who screams the loudest or attacks other people the best).

Edited by bmannion4

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3 hours ago, bmannion4 said:

Some comments don't warrant a reply. Just add a confused emoji next to their post. A lot of the people trying to debate/argue on these forums are just posting their feelings and opinions and lacking in any creative or rational thought towards game design.  

It's like children arguing over what ice cream taste the best and thinking they should make business decisions based on their outcome(generally who screams the loudest or attacks other people the best).

I respect your opinion but I dont agree. We got a bag full of nerfs already. I dont think that the solution is make the bag grow bigger. Instead learn to live with the meta builds and try to claw your way out in PvP. If you think that nerfing would make veteran any worse, you are wrong, nerf dont target players: traget servers, so Veteran simple respect and move to the next big build, and will continue to own you in regular basis. So dont try to "fix" what is not broken, this server is for OP builds or else instead of "Ascension" the would have called it "Decension". Cheers!

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40 minutes ago, Chronosk said:

I respect your opinion but I dont agree. We got a bag full of nerfs already. I dont think that the solution is make the bag grow bigger. Instead learn to live with the meta builds and try to claw your way out in PvP. If you think that nerfing would make veteran any worse, you are wrong, nerf dont target players: traget servers, so Veteran simple respect and move to the next big build, and will continue to own you in regular basis. So dont try to "fix" what is not broken, this server is for OP builds or else instead of "Ascension" the would have called it "Decension". Cheers!

I actually agree that "nerfs" are not the way to go, but there are definitely obvious opportunities for improvement. Simply nerfing whatever build comes out on top is just playing a game a whack-a-mole and will never solve the problem. I do think they could stand to normalize some pvp numbers that wouldn't impact pve and might even open up avenues for new builds.

What people fail to realize when they calls for pvp nerfs is that pve builds are in the exact same position balance wise. I think part of the solution is changing how AE and TE work in general and simply removing the flat % stat talents and replace them with something more interesting.

There will never be a dmg build that would pass up +5% damage talents. If everyone is required to pick certain talents to do end-game content(or pvp) then we only have the illusion of a classless system and choice. Sure, you can pick whatever you want, but if you don't pick these specific things you will be one shot or you won't have enough dps to raid.

Until the devs find a solution for the underlying problem the surface problems just don't have a real solution, and I agree that nerfs don't help and I don't think the devs should put resources into playing whack-a-mole. They should focus on treating the cause not the symptoms. 

 

All that being said, I was calling you out on a low effort post that didn't contribute to the topic being discussed in any meaningful way, your follow up post actually had some substance to it and you are right that people will just move to the next meta build and the min maxers will continue to min max.

Edited by bmannion4

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I agree Wynta.

And here is another problem:

In battlegrounds some people cheese the flag with CDs and lots of movement abilities. You can't stop them and they get every flag without problems.

Its really annoying and the pvp aspect in bgs is completly redundant. RITO PLS! Oh damn wrong game...

OK Ascension pls nerv dat sh*t !

 

I will write a guide for beginners how that tactic works. So everybody can cheese the bg and pvp is dead.
So u have to fix it quickly.

Edited by keyz

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I don't care for PVP much, but asking for balance is A LOT to ask, if not impossible.

Blizzard did a shitty job at it with Fixed classes and their abilities, can we expect ascension team to do it with players having all this freedom?

Aswell as touching any abilities or scaling will also impact PVE to a certain extend (not my baby!), maybe not the examples given, but think about that aswell.

You think your "share CDs" and "Nerf stuff I have trouble dealing with/ I think is OP" will change anything? 

I have my doubts and feel like everyone is on an even playing field here, when it comes to builds.

Don't get me wrong, the reason I NEVER queue for BGs is because I hate getting oneshot by those prep, shadowstep- Ambush LOL builds.. but that's what you get when you enter as a PVE healer.. I Choose not to deal with it. Pretty sure if you go back to the drawing table there is ways around the issues you mentioned above.

Edited by Bluefish

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Mmh i understand you. Some things are cool that they are the way they are. But there are some things that fundamentally destroy the gameplay.

In PvE nobody cares about it. But I play on Sargeras and its important to balance the PvP. Otherwise 90% of all spells are complete useless and 1-2 builds are the meta on Ascension.

 

The most oneshot builds are shitty because they have no utility and sustain. If you enter a BG as heal u need a lot of defensive CDs and stuns or fears.

 

For those who are interested, here is the link to the cancer guide I wanted to write:

The annoying cheeesy WS slippery GUIDE

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I too am a disgusted victim of how a TG alliance who had Bladestorm off cd running into 9 hordes summoning their last UBRS team mate (yep that was us) :'D and wreck us, aswell as live to tell the tale.. it's kind of messed up, suppose the penalty of it is much much bigger on Sarg than on my casual Cenarius realm.

so I can see where you are coming from, I'm just wondering weither nerfing one thing won't lead to a new "OPOP" rising etc etc, becoming a shitshow of nerfs that in the end don't solve the issue at hand.

Balance is such a delecate thing isn't it?

offtopic: @keyz do you stream Sarg or know of a player who does on regular basis? I'd like to see what it's like. Not a pvp player but it might spark something, curious.

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No I do not stream and I dont know anybody doing that. But I have record two short videos where you can see clearly what I mean.

Video 1
Video 2


Personally, I dont do this rush tactic. Watch the other team.

Edited by keyz

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thats wsg ..

but yea , idk the dmg nerf in Battlegrounds kinda destroyed ambush for BGs, the number of builds this build cant handle in 1v1s anymore, compared to outside of bgs, just got hugely increased.

Its way harder to burst someone in generall now, since almost all builds ran massive sustain in combination with defensives (the decent pvper) already and the devs basically pushed the Meta for BGs further into this playstyle.

Burst builds like ambush should exist and work for the reason of bringing balance to other Burst Builds. 

yes its frustrating for people in PvE Build to go into a mindless BG, want to have some fun but get one shot by a close to 4k ambush. But seriously, what is anyone expecting with low armor and 4k HP anyway? I think those people should actually be confronted with this Issue in Bgs first instead of in World. They should learn that their Build needs to give them some time and forgiveness against people who try to surprise burst kill them. It cant be too much that people should come up with the idea of allocating stamina and picking up ardent defender or Cheat death if they struggle with getting globaled ( killed in 1 sec )

And there are probably also a few other Builds that go with low HP and high dmg as their Playstyle and if they fear getting globaled they usually run Stealth or try some other way to mitigate the Risks their Build and playstyle brings with it.

And if that's actually not the Problem here, why did we get dmg reduction in bgs anyway since def cd stacking was already a problem? :D It just doesn't make any sense.

Edited by Shiru

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yeah I now know exactly what you mean, during WSG this weekend I thought it would be cool to rake some honor to respec my II into something useful rather than my old AoE farm spec.

This player destinee was running a flag build to farm rep, rendering normal play somewhat useless.. Doing something similar as to what you just posted in the videos above.

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still dont think anything wrong with tgrip easy to play vs

but defecive stacking and re stacking int to sp should be fixed/nerfed

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I deleted my chars now. Ascension is to boring with lvl 60. Maybe I test the new high risk realm but I only level there.

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The problem is that we have too many abilities etc.
Cut AE/TE in half and it'll be a much more diverse and healthy environment.

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Btw how many resilience do you have?

Because you talk about PvP, but in PvP you need it, except if you want to play like original true vanilla warrior, but at this time, PvP was broken ;)

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On 1/25/2018 at 10:31 PM, Chronosk said:

Instead learn to live with the meta builds and try to claw your way out in PvP.

The worst advice ever.

 

"Shits broke, but instead of trying to fix it just deal with it"

 

Fucking genius.

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