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Guest Wickedtoungue

some IDEAS

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Guest Wickedtoungue

just a few ideas I have...one is do not bring BC to your legecy servers. You are already half way there with your seasonal servers. My advice is do NOT kill something if its  going good. Make one seasonal server time locked. which means have one expansion there for so long or forever...if you decide to bring on an expansion to your normal servers it  could do well but it could do bad. 

Keep it simple. The reason I posted this is because I think that what you have going on  is going good for you. I would not fuck it up by adding an expansion, unless it is on another server aka seasonal. I say this because once you start adding more content to the game its going to be difficult to deal with many bugs. and dealing with many many more tickets.

sooo,  do like eq2, make seasonal servers with time locked expansions.  That way everyone gets what they want without force and you are gaining money. You already have the seasonal thing going, why not just make a Time locked server with an expansion?

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Wow so where to begin.

No that's a dumb idea, locking content is the worse idea you could possibly had people on legacy realms only stay on for new content, you'd just kill the server then.

no that' just spliting the population, seasonal's aren't going to last for ever and spliting the population it terrible for the long term survivle of ascension.

Adding an expansion isn't going to fuck up anything. do you realise how dumb this sounds your argument is that more content = more bugs so we shouldn't bring in more content lol what??!?

eq2 is a failure of a mmo and no one should follow their business examples.

 

td:dr op thinks locking content is good somehow even tho that's how you kill server, he has no idea what he's talking about and that's that seasonals should be focused rather then legacy lol.

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No, it's a good idea. If you polish the pseudo-vanilla game, you'll build a good base for heavier modifications in the future. That way you can create content for the game, built around psuedo-vanilla, that's stable. Expansions aren't a terrible idea but it's better as its own separate realm. Splitting the player base isn't a huge issue anyway, you'd have less players on the pseudo-vanilla server but it would slowly grow with veteran, long-term players. Vanity items can still be a thing, but it would be much more appealing for veteran players if it was reserved for inconsequential items like fishing poles, mining picks, items you can hold in off-hand like a mug you can drink out of, clothing, that sort of thing. Well I'd like to be able to drink out of a mug without paying for it, but you can have some vanity mugs or drink out of horns I guess. The tamer and less "powerful" the cosmetic, the better; small nuanced changes give more of a sense of customization and personalization for long-term players. Clearly WoW has a bit clunky of an aesthetic and models though, so adding something like instruments or whistles you can buy, or banners you can hold/ carry would be good. Transmog and such was a mistake honestly.

So to sum up the point and elaborate further, a more serious experience that makes each incremental progression feel impactful by spacing them out and giving none for free (in-game) besides some rare opportunism that's rooted in organic dynamics in-game, would really appeal to a veteran player base. This is best done by polishing a vanilla base enough so you can modify and add or remove content without a bunch of bugs popping up. It's a long-term strategy and a good business model. The general direction of game design would be toward power decay I suppose, compensated only by the increase, sophistication and dramatizing of mechanics and leveling progressions. That could be too programming/software engineering heavy for these developers though -- if they could do it, they could add mini-games if they wanted to, or rework entire mechanics like crafting (alchemy requires an alchemy set in-town or a limited portable one, and you have to grind reagents, distill, etc.), add their own creative card game with server ranks and such. Removing the quest markers and a few other very "gamey" things would be good on this hypothetical realm. If they add a literal card game to this modified pseudo-vanilla realm, they could add vanity card sets. If they make certain things in the economy more player driven, they could do something like add custom bottle designs/labels on your alchemy potions that you payed a dollar for, that you just uploaded and got approved.

If they create a server they can heavily modify in the future without a million bugs, it would be good for everyone.

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Posted (edited)
Just now, Oaknell said:

No, it's a good idea. If you polish the pseudo-vanilla game, you'll build a good base for heavier modifications in the future. That way you can create content for the game, built around psuedo-vanilla, that's stable. Expansions aren't a terrible idea but it's better as its own separate realm. Splitting the player base isn't a huge issue anyway, you'd have less players on the pseudo-vanilla server but it would slowly grow with veteran, long-term players. Vanity items can still be a thing, but it would be much more appealing for veteran players if it was reserved for inconsequential items like fishing poles, mining picks, items you can hold in off-hand like a mug you can drink out of, clothing, that sort of thing. Well I'd like to be able to drink out of a mug without paying for it, but you can have some vanity mugs or drink out of horns I guess. The tamer and less "powerful" the cosmetic, the better; small nuanced changes give more of a sense of customization and personalization for long-term players. Clearly WoW has a bit clunky of an aesthetic and models though, so adding something like instruments or whistles you can buy, or banners you can hold/ carry would be good. Transmog and such was a mistake honestly.

So to sum up the point and elaborate further, a more serious experience that makes each incremental progression feel impactful by spacing them out and giving none for free (in-game) besides some rare opportunism that's rooted in organic dynamics in-game, would really appeal to a veteran player base. This is best done by polishing a vanilla base enough so you can modify and add or remove content without a bunch of bugs popping up. It's a long-term strategy and a good business model. The general direction of game design would be toward power decay I suppose, compensated only by the increase, sophistication and dramatizing of mechanics and leveling progressions. That could be too programming/software engineering heavy for these developers though -- if they could do it, they could add mini-games if they wanted to, or rework entire mechanics like crafting (alchemy requires an alchemy set in-town or a limited portable one, and you have to grind reagents, distill, etc.), add their own creative card game with server ranks and such. Removing the quest markers and a few other very "gamey" things would be good on this hypothetical realm. If they add a literal card game to this modified pseudo-vanilla realm, they could add vanity card sets. If they make certain things in the economy more player driven, they could do something like add custom bottle designs/labels on your alchemy potions that you payed a dollar for, that you just uploaded and got approved.

If they create a server they can heavily modify in the future without a million bugs, it would be good for everyone.

no it's fucking stupid,  no the people in legacy realsm want tbc, they don't want to be locked out? it's easy to see that your a new player and don't understand how bad lack of content has had ascension.

veterns don't want a pesudo vanilla server most of us want tbc it's why most of us have bought the tbc beta.

vanity items really? you think that's what people really care about? no one is going to want cosmetic items over content dude.

Let me sum up how dumb of a post you just made.

Just now, Oaknell said:

Splitting the player base isn't a huge issue anyway,

It's a massive issue that's almost killed ascension twice already. once in 2017 december and again in 2018 after season 1

Just now, Oaknell said:

Vanity items can still be a thing, but it would be much more appealing for veteran players if it was reserved for inconsequential items like fishing poles, mining picks, items you can hold in off-hand like a mug you can drink out of, clothing, that sort of thing.

What, what exactly makes you think that vetern players want vanity items over an expasion.

Just now, Oaknell said:

This is best done by polishing a vanilla base enough so you can modify and add or remove content without a bunch of bugs popping up. It's a long-term strategy and a good business model.

no it's not a good business model because the amount of time it would take to do something like this would be in the years, which will kill the server.

 

Just now, Oaknell said:

That could be too programming/software engineering heavy for these developers though -- if they could do it, they could add mini-games if they wanted to, or rework entire mechanics like crafting (alchemy requires an alchemy set in-town or a limited portable one, and you have to grind reagents, distill, etc.), add their own creative card game with server ranks and such. Removing the quest markers and a few other very "gamey" things would be good on this hypothetical realm.

Now your just wanting a straight up different game, do you even know how massive if a undertaking it would be to do what you are describing?  this isn't something that can just be done in 1 week.

 

Just now, Oaknell said:

If they add a literal card game to this modified pseudo-vanilla realm, they could add vanity card sets. If they make certain things in the economy more player driven, they could do something like add custom bottle designs/labels on your alchemy potions that you payed a dollar for, that you just uploaded and got approved.

If they create a server they can heavily modify in the future without a million bugs, it would be good for everyone.

What are you even talking about now, none of which is possible in any current emulation of wow and to try and add something to this game would be such a massive waste of resources not to mentions years of time.  Not to mention it's practicly impossible to make a heavily modifiable server that's also bug free,  the more freedom a program has the more places that it can break.

Edited by SirGank

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I meant veterans of WoW not of Ascension. I didn't say anything about locking people out of content either. I suggested that they keep one server Vanilla and work on it to become more bug free and build it better so it can be modified heavier. I then suggested some ideas, some of which would only be applicable far into the future in order to invite whomever is reading to imagine what could be done on a server that can be heavily modified. The card game isn't an entirely different game -- it's a mini-game within the game. You'd go to an Inn and people at that Inn could sit down at a table with you and you could play a card game. It is an idea that was originally going to be added to Vanilla WoW but time was limited or something. It would add immersion to the game for sure, and give people a reason to hang around.

You say it would be "nearly impossible", which I can agree with if the developers are amateurs. They might be, after all. I don't know how the game is coded, but if it's modular enough and was built with good design principles in mind, if it breaks it should break only where you messed with it. If you add a card game that you can sit down and play in Inns, then it should only break when and where you play the card game. That would make it much easier to deal with, and it would be an issue with added content, not base content.

The reason I bring up vanity items is because the developers would be thinking of ways to monetize the game, and if you create a version of the game that's impossible to monetize or attract players that won't spend a dime on it, they're not going to make it. The people who work on Ascension don't want their job to disappear or wind up being payed less, if there's no future in it they'll just leave; then they'll have to hire less experienced staff that have to learn how Ascension/WoW code works. All of this will lead to Ascension dying or content being heavily delayed and low quality; they'll bleed out and eventually shut down the servers.

I don't think you are equipped to make constructive contributions to the discussion.

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4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

I meant veterans of WoW not of Ascension. I didn't say anything about locking people out of content either. I suggested that they keep one server Vanilla and work on it to become more bug free and build it better so it can be modified heavier. I then suggested some ideas, some of which would only be applicable far into the future in order to invite whomever is reading to imagine what could be done on a server that can be heavily modified. The card game isn't an entirely different game -- it's a mini-game within the game. You'd go to an Inn and people at that Inn could sit down at a table with you and you could play a card game. It is an idea that was originally going to be added to Vanilla WoW but time was limited or something. It would add immersion to the game for sure, and give people a reason to hang around.

You say it would be "nearly impossible", which I can agree with if the developers are amateurs. They might be, after all. I don't know how the game is coded, but if it's modular enough and was built with good design principles in mind, if it breaks it should break only where you messed with it. If you add a card game that you can sit down and play in Inns, then it should only break when and where you play the card game. That would make it much easier to deal with, and it would be an issue with added content, not base content.

The reason I bring up vanity items is because the developers would be thinking of ways to monetize the game, and if you create a version of the game that's impossible to monetize or attract players that won't spend a dime on it, they're not going to make it. The people who work on Ascension don't want their job to disappear or wind up being payed less, if there's no future in it they'll just leave; then they'll have to hire less experienced staff that have to learn how Ascension/WoW code works. All of this will lead to Ascension dying or content being heavily delayed and low quality; they'll bleed out and eventually shut down the servers.

I don't think you are equipped to make constructive contributions to the discussion.

Making more servers and locking them to xpacs is a terrible idea as it splits the population, the current population of ascension is not an accurate representation of ascensions average populations and making plans based on current populations is a very bad and costly mistake.

 

it also wastes resources, ascension isn't a project that can just throw developers as any idea, it takes them 6-9 months just to make a raid ready.

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

The card game isn't an entirely different game

Compaired to a rpg mmo ya um it is dude.

 

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

it's a mini-game within the game

And tho's take a massive amount of time to make.

 

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

You'd go to an Inn and people at that Inn could sit down at a table with you and you could play a card game. It is an idea that was originally going to be added to Vanilla WoW but time was limited or something

Ya because it's a massive amount of work to implimient into a game like wow, the game it self is limited in what it could do and trying to add something like this would take more time then it's worth.

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

You say it would be "nearly impossible", which I can agree with if the developers are amateurs. They might be, after all. I don't know how the game is coded, but if it's modular enough and was built with good design principles in mind, if it breaks it should break only where you messed with it. If you add a card game that you can sit down and play in Inns, then it should only break when and where you play the card game. That would make it much easier to deal with, and it would be an issue with added content, not base content.

O god where do I start with this, first off, you don't know how it's coded and yet you keep talking ok about how you can do this and that with the game.

second: Ascension wow and every other private server is made off of emualation projects (probably mangos) and not offical code from blizzard, so it wasn't "build with good design principles"

third: ascension is most likley not "Modular enough" based on the kind of bugs we've seen in ascension.

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

The reason I bring up vanity items is because the developers would be thinking of ways to monetize the game, and if you create a version of the game that's impossible to monetize or attract players that won't spend a dime on it, they're not going to make it.

They are making more then enough monetization.

 

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

I don't think you are equipped to make constructive contributions to the discussion.

Let's recap, you don't know how wow is coded, you assume ascnesion/wow  is "modular enough". you probably at best a passing knowledge of how programming works or you would say things like adding a card game into a emulation project that can barely at times manage it self. I don't think you are equipped to make any constructive contributions to this discussion.

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10 minutes ago, SirGank said:

They are making more then enough monetization.

11 minutes ago, SirGank said:

the current population of ascension is not an accurate representation of ascensions average populations and making plans based on current populations is a very bad and costly mistake.

If they're not making enough money, then they will be looking to make more. I'm not basing what I say much on current population, I'm basing it on what would attract more people to Ascension and how to turn short-term players into long-term players.

14 minutes ago, SirGank said:

it also wastes resources, ascension isn't a project that can just throw developers as any idea, it takes them 6-9 months just to make a raid ready.

17 minutes ago, SirGank said:

Ascension wow and every other private server is made off of emualation projects (probably mangos) and not offical code from blizzard, so it wasn't "build with good design principles"

If it takes them that long to come out with a raid, they either aren't working on it full-time, are purposefully petering out the raids, or are not very good developers. If they aren't good developers, Ascension will die either way, and you're just on for the joy ride while it lasts.

26 minutes ago, SirGank said:

it also wastes resources, ascension isn't a project that can just throw developers as any idea

26 minutes ago, SirGank said:

O god where do I start with this, first off, you don't know how it's coded and yet you keep talking ok about how you can do this and that with the game.

Only after it's been hypothetically cleaned up internally, and made bug free and very stable, did I offer ideas to be implemented. If it had a solid code base then yes, any idea could be thrown at it and it would be much more cost efficient.

6 hours ago, Oaknell said:

I suggested that they keep one server Vanilla and work on it to become more bug free and build it better so it can be modified heavier.

It's the second line of my last post.

I'll add that many players don't stay or never use private servers because of how buggy, unreliable and inconsistent they are. The bugs really ruin the experience for many people. Remove the bugs and Ascension would become very well known and popular, unless they ruin the server some other way. Less is more.

42 minutes ago, SirGank said:

Let's recap, you don't know how wow is coded, you assume ascnesion/wow  is "modular enough". you probably at best a passing knowledge of how programming works or you would say things like adding a card game into a emulation project that can barely at times manage it self. I don't think you are equipped to make any constructive contributions to this discussion.

You are a very bratty teenager, and your mind has misrepresented what I've said of which I have addressed in this post.

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19 hours ago, Oaknell said:

If they're not making enough money, then they will be looking to make more. I'm not basing what I say much on current population, I'm basing it on what would attract more people to Ascension and how to turn short-term players into long-term players.

You have no evidence of what your basing on would bring any good long term and in fact goes opposite of what has proven to be the correct way forward for ascension.

19 hours ago, Oaknell said:

If it takes them that long to come out with a raid, they either aren't working on it full-time, are purposefully petering out the raids, or are not very good developers. If they aren't good developers, Ascension will die either way, and you're just on for the joy ride while it lasts.

Acutally most of the dev's working on the raids are very good, it just takes months to script content correctly and rebalance it and add in custom features, this isn't something you can add in a week. Blizzard even takes months to some times a year to introduce new raids.

 

19 hours ago, Oaknell said:

Only after it's been hypothetically cleaned up internally, and made bug free and very stable, did I offer ideas to be implemented. If it had a solid code base then yes, any idea could be thrown at it and it would be much more cost efficient.

Hypothetically cleaned up? do you even know how long of a process that would. and no amount of solid coding in the world can make a game fully modular, every single game has a limit to what you can do with it with out completely recording the whole game and ripping out old code that doesn't work a process that would take actual years to do as they're basically making a new game at that point.

19 hours ago, Oaknell said:

It's the second line of my last post.

I'll add that many players don't stay or never use private servers because of how buggy, unreliable and inconsistent they are. The bugs really ruin the experience for many people. Remove the bugs and Ascension would become very well known and popular, unless they ruin the server some other way. Less is more.

Where not here to talk about other servers, but just to make your point invalid, there are tons of servers with massively shitty scripting that keep thousands of players on their server at any time.

 

19 hours ago, Oaknell said:

You are a very bratty teenager, and your mind has misrepresented what I've said of which I have addressed in this post.

O hay everyone look, it's the old "I've lost the argument and can't actually refute any of the arguments and points made at me so I'll resort to calling the person a "Kid" and say he just doesn't understand me rather then admit that I'm wrong."

 

 

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15 hours ago, SirGank said:

You have no evidence of what your basing on would bring any good long term and in fact goes opposite of what has proven to be the correct way forward for ascension.

16 hours ago, SirGank said:

Where not here to talk about other servers, but just to make your point invalid, there are tons of servers with massively shitty scripting that keep thousands of players on their server at any time.

Servers don't or do succeed due to their quality. Whether it's a buggy piece of shit or not is a large part of whether it's a quality server or not. This is basic fucking common sense. I'm not sure what servers you're speaking of, and it could be true, or it could not. If it's true, then they have a lot more going for them and the scripting can't be bad enough that it keeps players away. I never said to get rid of wildcard or to not develop more custom game modes/servers, I suggest they take one server of theirs that isn't Wildcard or Season 4, and make it as solid and bug free as possible so that they can MODIFY IT FURTHER -- they do custom shit like Wildcard, so how the fuck is creating a server that can do that sort of thing + MORE, with EASE not the "correct way forward for ascension"? I'm calling bullshit on TONS of servers with MASSIVELY shitty scripting that have THOUSANDS of players at ANY give time.

"No evidence. . . . would bring any good long term [players]" Yeah I guess there's no evidence that Classic would succeed either. . . . I mean, who remembers Vanilla? Who cares about Vanilla? So much fucking grinding and it isn't even that competitively balanced. . . . HUGE flop, just ignore the retards Blizzard. NO evidence. Who wants bug free? No one. Everyone wants fucked up buggy shit, all day every day. That would bring in NO new players, and NO one would stay to play on a bug free private server. NO ONE. A bug free private server that can support heavy modifications without a huge investment in bug fixing once it's done? NO ONE.

Ya know, I'd support just getting rid of the countless fucking bugs they already have, any way they fucking can. How about that much? Just get rid of the fucking bugs.

15 hours ago, SirGank said:

Acutally most of the dev's working on the raids are very good, it just takes months to script content correctly and rebalance it and add in custom features, this isn't something you can add in a week. Blizzard even takes months to some times a year to introduce new raids.

Yes, very good. Ascension is VERY GOOD, and its developers are VERY GOOD DEVELOPERS. (did i do good daddy?) Don't check the warman e devlog or anything, or their changelog, where they fix every single bug they have while working on Burning Crusade, WotLK and MISTS OF PANDERIA. . . . don't look at that, please! Not like they get raids out, while doing all this, in less time than 6 - 9 months.

Ascension was at a monthly pace until the latest raids. What changed? Most likely the team is falling apart, they lost some good developer or three, and now they have a shit team working on it.

And Blizzard is DEFINITELY not creating entirely new content out of thin air and not just scripting shit that already fucking exists. . . . definitely just using the level, assets, creatures, spells, animations that already exist. . . . for sure. Nothing more difficult to do or anything.

16 hours ago, SirGank said:

Hypothetically cleaned up? do you even know how long of a process that would. and no amount of solid coding in the world can make a game fully modular, every single game has a limit to what you can do with it with out completely recording the whole game and ripping out old code that doesn't work a process that would take actual years to do as they're basically making a new game at that point.

How long it would take depends on the developers. If Ascension are bad at what they do, they might not even be capable of it. Solid coding would definitely make the game much more modular though, I have no clue where you learned anything about software, even as a layman (I'm guessing from Ascension and amateurs in general), but you're right that it could take years to make the whole game heavily customizable without big bugs popping up. Luckily, if you have some idea of what you want to do with the game in the future, you don't have to rewrite literally the entire thing, and you don't have to make everything so clean that you can literally do anything and no bugs will pop up, but you can make it so that it can support what you plan to do with it in the future and the bugs be very manageable and much easier to fix.

16 hours ago, SirGank said:

O hay everyone look, it's the old "I've lost the argument and can't actually refute any of the arguments and points made at me so I'll resort to calling the person a "Kid" and say he just doesn't understand me rather then admit that I'm wrong."

You think in fucking memes. Like a fucking teenager.

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Nostalrius was entirely Vanilla, and was hitting 12k pop when it got shut down. It was rather stable and bug free. No cash shop or anything. Most popular server in its time I believe. Yet you think locking a server at Vanilla when there are four available, and making the Vanilla experience as smooth and bug free as possible isn't going to attract any players. The Vanilla raid content isn't even all out yet, starting now to make the game bug free only makes sense. The step after that that I suggest is to rework the game so that heavier modification is possible -- all that may be required is better documentation and understanding of how the code works, in which case do THAT and they can modify it with greater ease in the future, and all bugs that do pop up will be easily squashed. If they lock a server (you'll be waiting for BC another year+ anyway) and polish then rework it, they can use that version for ALL crazy game modes they can think of in the future. There are already FOUR servers. The population is ALREADY SPLIT between FOUR servers, and they JUST split the High Risk/No Risk players between Laughing Skull and Andorhal by making them Hybrid Risk (I play Laughing Skull but assume Andorhal as well). You're a fucking idiot.

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Just now, Oaknell said:

Servers don't or do succeed due to their quality. Whether it's a buggy piece of shit or not is a large part of whether it's a quality server or not. This is basic fucking common sense. I'm not sure what servers you're speaking of, and it could be true, or it could not. If it's true, then they have a lot more going for them and the scripting can't be bad enough that it keeps players away. I never said to get rid of wildcard or to not develop more custom game modes/servers, I suggest they take one server of theirs that isn't Wildcard or Season 4, and make it as solid and bug free as possible so that they can MODIFY IT FURTHER -- they do custom shit like Wildcard, so how the fuck is creating a server that can do that sort of thing + MORE, with EASE not the "correct way forward for ascension"? I'm calling bullshit on TONS of servers with MASSIVELY shitty scripting that have THOUSANDS of players at ANY give time.

"No evidence. . . . would bring any good long term [players]" Yeah I guess there's no evidence that Classic would succeed either. . . . I mean, who remembers Vanilla? Who cares about Vanilla? So much fucking grinding and it isn't even that competitively balanced. . . . HUGE flop, just ignore the retards Blizzard. NO evidence. Who wants bug free? No one. Everyone wants fucked up buggy shit, all day every day. That would bring in NO new players, and NO one would stay to play on a bug free private server. NO ONE. A bug free private server that can support heavy modifications without a huge investment in bug fixing once it's done? NO ONE.

Ya know, I'd support just getting rid of the countless fucking bugs they already have, any way they fucking can. How about that much? Just get rid of the fucking bugs.

 

On 6/9/2019 at 1:27 AM, Oaknell said:

I'll add that many players don't stay or never use private servers because of how buggy, unreliable and inconsistent they are. The bugs really ruin the experience for many people.

which is it hu?

 

Just now, Oaknell said:

Yes, very good. Ascension is VERY GOOD, and its developers are VERY GOOD DEVELOPERS. (did i do good daddy?) Don't check the warman e devlog or anything, or their changelog, where they fix every single bug they have while working on Burning Crusade, WotLK and MISTS OF PANDERIA. . . . don't look at that, please! Not like they get raids out, while doing all this, in less time than 6 - 9 months.

Tho's dev's have a massively more resources and income then ascension.  you're compairing two different groups that have different amounts of resources. your saying that because group a can do it that means group b can also not matter what. oof dude oof, that's like saying Inde dev team should be able to make a open world fully fleshed rpg be cause a aaa company can.

 

3 minutes ago, Oaknell said:

How long it would take depends on the developers. If Ascension are bad at what they do, they might not even be capable of it. Solid coding would definitely make the game much more modular though, I have no clue where you learned anything about software, even as a layman (I'm guessing from Ascension and amateurs in general), but you're right that it could take years to make the whole game heavily customizable without big bugs popping up. Luckily, if you have some idea of what you want to do with the game in the future, you don't have to rewrite literally the entire thing, and you don't have to make everything so clean that you can literally do anything and no bugs will pop up, but you can make it so that it can support what you plan to do with it in the future and the bugs be very manageable and much easier to fix.

You have no idea how coding works do you, you can't just rewrite half the code and think it will work out well, there would be so many massive conflicting issues within the code that the only way possible way to do what you are saying is to rewrite the whole code. you think you can just throw code together and it should all work but that's now how it works.

5 minutes ago, Oaknell said:

You think in fucking memes. Like a fucking teenager.

And here you prove me more about how instead of being able to actually counter argue my points you rather just try and make some arbitrary comment about my age because you think for some reason that age matters rather then facts. just shows you have no idea what your talking about.

 

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Just now, Oaknell said:

Nostalrius was entirely Vanilla, and was hitting 12k pop when it got shut down. It was rather stable and bug free. No cash shop or anything. Most popular server in its time I believe. Yet you think locking a server at Vanilla when there are four available, and making the Vanilla experience as smooth and bug free as possible isn't going to attract any players. The Vanilla raid content isn't even all out yet, starting now to make the game bug free only makes sense. The step after that that I suggest is to rework the game so that heavier modification is possible -- all that may be required is better documentation and understanding of how the code works, in which case do THAT and they can modify it with greater ease in the future, and all bugs that do pop up will be easily squashed. If they lock a server (you'll be waiting for BC another year+ anyway) and polish then rework it, they can use that version for ALL crazy game modes they can think of in the future. There are already FOUR servers. The population is ALREADY SPLIT between FOUR servers, and they JUST split the High Risk/No Risk players between Laughing Skull and Andorhal by making them Hybrid Risk (I play Laughing Skull but assume Andorhal as well). You're a fucking idiot.

HHAHAAHAHAH nostalrius was a buggy mess at points mate, lol it wasn't some perfect PS that never had problems it had major problems in raids and dungeons. like I said before you have no clue on how the acutal process of coding works and you think you can just snap your fingers and it will be done in 1-3 months of time.

First: There isn't any acutely official documentation for vanilla wow, everything including the emulation is made from pieces together information. so that already makes it very difficult to do what you say.

Bc isn't a year away, it's coming out within the year.

Yes the population is split because of the high population that we are currently having but thinking that population will last would be the dumbest mistake you can make, we're already have two examples of ascension getting a large population for a few months then dieing out after time, not because of coding but because of other factors.

 

Just now, Oaknell said:

You're a fucking idiot.

I know you are but what am I :).

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2 hours ago, SirGank said:

which is it hu?

What are you referring to. There's no contradiction between "many players don't play specific server groups or private WoW at all due to too many bugs" and "some servers have a thousand to a couple thousand players on most of the time despite being buggy". You haven't cited which servers are holding thousands of players, online at any given time, despite MASSIVE bugs.

2 hours ago, SirGank said:

Tho's dev's have a massively more resources and income then ascension.  you're compairing two different groups that have different amounts of resources. your saying that because group a can do it that means group b can also not matter what. oof dude oof, that's like saying Inde dev team should be able to make a open world fully fleshed rpg be cause a aaa company can.

I'm not saying they should be developing several things at once like some other server group you dumb fuck, I'm saying that other servers are pulling much more shit onto their plate, getting it done faster, and are fixing all of their bugs as well. You admit that they're a small team and have to work on smaller projects, yet don't want them to focus on fixing what they have or doing some deeper work so they can occupy a solid niche or even expand to become a much bigger and popular server group -- you want them to expand to BC, then fucking WotLK I'm guessing, before they even fix their bugs.

2 hours ago, SirGank said:

You have no idea how coding works do you, you can't just rewrite half the code and think it will work out well, there would be so many massive conflicting issues within the code that the only way possible way to do what you are saying is to rewrite the whole code. you think you can just throw code together and it should all work but that's now how it works.

"you think you can throw code together" no, that's what you're saying I think. You don't know what the code is. I haven't literally seen the code with my own two eyes, and I haven't heard the opinion of expert coders who have seen the code, and I certainly haven't heard the opinion of expert coders with no affiliation with different views who hold the same opinion on the code, that they have seen with their own two eyes. You have no way of arguing either way if it could or could not work. There's no point to argue over something neither of us has any direct knowledge of; it's a fucking suggestion that COULD work depending on factors we personally don't have knowledge of.

2 hours ago, SirGank said:

And here you prove me more about how instead of being able to actually counter argue my points you rather just try and make some arbitrary comment about my age because you think for some reason that age matters rather then facts. just shows you have no idea what your talking about.

I've been countering your fucking points you dumb fuck. You're regurgitating some shit and it doesn't even apply.

2 hours ago, SirGank said:

nostalrius was a buggy mess at points mate

"at points" k. Glad you didn't say "always". "at points" is pretty fucking reasonable. "Always" is not.

2 hours ago, SirGank said:

we're already have two examples of ascension getting a large population for a few months then dieing out after time, not because of coding but because of other factors.

So something that would attract players that want to stick around would be a good thing? Hmm. I wonder how that can be done. . . . maybe by doing what everyone else does? That could do it. Release a buggy BC and hope for the best.

What are these "other factors" according to you.

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4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

What are you referring to. There's no contradiction between "many players don't play specific server groups or private WoW at all due to too many bugs" and "some servers have a thousand to a couple thousand players on most of the time despite being buggy". You haven't cited which servers are holding thousands of players, online at any given time, despite MASSIVE bugs.

I haven't because we're technically not allowed to talk about other servers in the forums.

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

I'm not saying they should be developing several things at once like some other server group you dumb fuck, I'm saying that other servers are pulling much more shit onto their plate, getting it done faster, and are fixing all of their bugs as well. You admit that they're a small team and have to work on smaller projects, yet don't want them to focus on fixing what they have or doing some deeper work so they can occupy a solid niche or even expand to become a much bigger and popular server group -- you want them to expand to BC, then fucking WotLK I'm guessing, before they even fix their bugs.

Oof dude, first off insulting other with that language isn't allowed on the fours. second What how is a stock wrath server putting more on it's plate then a fully custom server that allows any combination of ability's and talents while also have a custom re enchanting on gear and also custom raid content??? when did I say I don't want them to focus on fixing things, all I've said is that your idea is not with in the realm of possibility as it will take years to complete because of many factors, Like how the base emulation this based on secondhand information about vanilla and how the emulation is made from an open source project so meaning that the bare bones of the project aren't the most stable and to make them stable would require an almost complete re coding to fix it. and even if they where to do that there is no official documentation for the coding of wow so all information about how the game should run would be second hand at best, you basically asking th dev's the re code the whole game to make it more optimism to run better so that bugs would be less of a problem when introducing new content, yet to do that would require MASSIVE amount of work that I don't think you understand.

4 hours ago, Oaknell said:

"you think you can throw code together" no, that's what you're saying I think. You don't know what the code is. I haven't literally seen the code with my own two eyes, and I haven't heard the opinion of expert coders who have seen the code, and I certainly haven't heard the opinion of expert coders with no affiliation with different views who hold the same opinion on the code, that they have seen with their own two eyes. You have no way of arguing either way if it could or could not work. There's no point to argue over something neither of us has any direct knowledge of; it's a fucking suggestion that COULD work depending on factors we personally don't have knowledge of.

What exctly makes you think I have no experiance in the emulation that this sever is based on, I know for a fact that while this server is well scripted the things you want to do would not be possible with out basicly making a whole new game, there are limits to what you can do with what they have and what you want to do is not possible with out work that's not possible in any realistic time scheduled. Just because you have no knowledge about how wow emulation that doesn't mean anyone else could know.

 

5 hours ago, Oaknell said:

I've been countering your fucking points you dumb fuck. You're regurgitating some shit and it doesn't even apply.

I fail to see how insults count as countering my points, you your self have said you haven't seen seen the code, haven't here the opinions of experts (I guess I don't count cuz I'm disagreeing with you. even tho I know a thing or two about wow emulation) or haven't hear the opinion of expert coders (which is subjective of what an expert in coding means as coding isn't a straight path.) but again because I dissagree with you I must know nothing about this topic at all because in your words i'm a

 

7 hours ago, Oaknell said:

You're a fucking idiot.

5 hours ago, Oaknell said:

you dumb fuck

8 hours ago, Oaknell said:

Like a fucking teenager.

:)

5 hours ago, Oaknell said:

"at points" k. Glad you didn't say "always". "at points" is pretty fucking reasonable. "Always" is not. 

A stopped clock is right twice a day. but in all fareness that sever did have problems with it as all emualtion does that isn't really possible to fix with out major re coding that can take months- years to fix depending on the team size and problem.

 

5 hours ago, Oaknell said:

So something that would attract players that want to stick around would be a good thing? Hmm. I wonder how that can be done. . . . maybe by doing what everyone else does? That could do it. Release a buggy BC and hope for the best. 

What are these "other factors" according to you.

Not sure where you think BC is a massively buggy mess, I found it to be quite working when I test on it. and the other factors are the fact that it's a customer fun server is a large population of the ps community aren't interested in it as the main factor for most ps is blizzard like ect. which ascension is not.

 

I look forward to you proving my point more on how you know nothing about what you talk and your need to insult me because again you can't actually counter anything I've said. also have a nice day ❤️

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On ‎6‎/‎8‎/‎2019 at 11:48 PM, Oaknell said:

No, it's a good idea. If you polish the pseudo-vanilla game, you'll build a good base for heavier modifications in the future. That way you can create content for the game, built around psuedo-vanilla, that's stable. Expansions aren't a terrible idea but it's better as its own separate realm. Splitting the player base isn't a huge issue anyway, you'd have less players on the pseudo-vanilla server but it would slowly grow with veteran, long-term players. Vanity items can still be a thing, but it would be much more appealing for veteran players if it was reserved for inconsequential items like fishing poles, mining picks, items you can hold in off-hand like a mug you can drink out of, clothing, that sort of thing. Well I'd like to be able to drink out of a mug without paying for it, but you can have some vanity mugs or drink out of horns I guess. The tamer and less "powerful" the cosmetic, the better; small nuanced changes give more of a sense of customization and personalization for long-term players. Clearly WoW has a bit clunky of an aesthetic and models though, so adding something like instruments or whistles you can buy, or banners you can hold/ carry would be good. Transmog and such was a mistake honestly.

So to sum up the point and elaborate further, a more serious experience that makes each incremental progression feel impactful by spacing them out and giving none for free (in-game) besides some rare opportunism that's rooted in organic dynamics in-game, would really appeal to a veteran player base. This is best done by polishing a vanilla base enough so you can modify and add or remove content without a bunch of bugs popping up. It's a long-term strategy and a good business model. The general direction of game design would be toward power decay I suppose, compensated only by the increase, sophistication and dramatizing of mechanics and leveling progressions. That could be too programming/software engineering heavy for these developers though -- if they could do it, they could add mini-games if they wanted to, or rework entire mechanics like crafting (alchemy requires an alchemy set in-town or a limited portable one, and you have to grind reagents, distill, etc.), add their own creative card game with server ranks and such. Removing the quest markers and a few other very "gamey" things would be good on this hypothetical realm. If they add a literal card game to this modified pseudo-vanilla realm, they could add vanity card sets. If they make certain things in the economy more player driven, they could do something like add custom bottle designs/labels on your alchemy potions that you payed a dollar for, that you just uploaded and got approved.

If they create a server they can heavily modify in the future without a million bugs, it would be good for everyone.

 

Lets get this straight, you just listening very specific things you want in the game. But you have no idea how long those things would need to implement and how tiny of a player base really wants crap like "a card game" or "pictures on alchemy bottles". LOL - PICTURES ON ALCHEMY BOTTLES. Like wtf.

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